I think the problem is treating having children as a goal rather than a fact of life, at least here in the US. The parenting culture is especially insane, and of the people I know that have children, all they talk about is their kids. No hobbies, no aspirations, just their kids.
So, there are absolutely some people who make their kids their whole personality and live vicariously through them.
That said, speaking from my own experience & conversations with other parents, for most of us, hobbies and goals are still there, they're just rewired around the responsibility of having a kid. I aspire to do well at work, but it's less about personal ambition and more about providing a stable environment for my son to grow up in. I love to read and write, and I still carve out time to keep up with friends over video games, but my son does take priority over those things if the need arises. We talk about our kids a lot because we love them a lot - but if you find the right topic, I think many parents would welcome the chance to talk about other stuff.
If I get my way, I'll still be reading and writing, playing video games with friends - I'll just have more time for those things, especially after retirement. That, and more travelling. All with the added bonus of knowing that I've prepared my son for the world and the hope that he knows that if he ever needs me as he makes his way through that world, I'll be there.
Granted, that's at least 16 years away and my wife & I are hoping for at least one more kiddo, so we've got a ways to go before then.
Sorry if I wasn't clear on that - I already do those things now. I read and write during downtime, I have a dedicated game night with friends each week, and my family travels 1-2 times a year. I may have more time for those things when the nest is empty, but I already have plenty of things that give me fulfillment in addition to being a dad.
I think the meaning point is key. I’m still in a life stage where most of my friends don’t have kids yet, so I know a lot of people living the DINK lifestyle. It is really nice in many ways—lots of travel, good food, lots of time for socializing with friends—but also many of these friends express various existential anxieties. They’ll say things like “I don’t know what I’m doing with my life”, or decide to move to new cities to shake things up but then not seem to feel much different once they settle in. I’ve felt a lot of this myself as a single person who doesn’t (yet) have kids.
Parents may have more obligations and stressors, but they also have an answer to their existential anxieties.
Great point, Marcus. I think that search for meaning is a natural part of being human. While I don't think it's impossible for people to find meaning and satisfaction without kids, I think a lot of things have to go right for that happen - many of which may not be in our control. While I'll be the first to say that there are absolutely obligations with parenting, those obligations are what help make it meaningful.
Boomers infantilized and helicopter parented their kids and I think it has much to do with this.
They complained so much to their kids about how hard it was to raise them, and how much they “had to” sacrifice and worry.
Boomers still treat fully grown middle age adults like children, micromanage them, etc. and seem to have no awareness that yes, your son/daughter doesn’t know how to cook because, whereas you were 5 years old cooking for your siblings, they were 12 and you wouldn’t let them use the microwave, or you may have attempted to teach them to cook but they got something slightly wrong and the boomer said “looks like you’re not ready to cook. I’ll do it so it’s done right. I’m the only one who ever does anything around here!”
Big surprise a lot of people don’t want to replicate that.
On an individual level, choosing not to have children can be economically rational. That’s hard to deny. But when that logic scales across society, it tends to drift toward a worldview where anything beyond one’s own lifetime feels optional or abstract. Rational choices at the individual level don’t always add up to rational outcomes for society as a whole.
If we care about social continuity — not in a moralizing way, but in a practical one — then some people choosing to raise children becomes necessary. Not because it’s efficient, but because it sustains the conditions that make everyday life workable in the long run.
Having children is, in many ways, deeply “irrational.” And yet, when I imagine the end of my life, the idea of having connected myself to the future through my children — and being surrounded by them at the end — feels profoundly meaningful. That outcome carries real value, even if it can’t be captured by short-term cost-benefit analysis.
So the question may not be whether raising children is rational in a narrow sense, but whether paying the time and economic costs for the sake of the final image of one’s life is truly irrational at all. That seems worth sitting with.
Hi Shun, sorry for the slight delay in responding, we had inclement weather and I was home with my son!
I think we are on the exact same page - the microeconomic rationale for having kids has inverted, while the macroeconomic rationale is becoming increasingly fraught, and that cuts across borders.
Thanks so much, Bri, I so appreciate it! Also, sorry for the slight delay in responding, ice storm down in Texas had me staying home with my kiddo a couple of days - not much time for Substack!
I can only speak for myself. If I didn't have kids, I feel I would be more selfish and less responsible. My grandparents told me growing up that the world was going to hell in a hand basket. Then my parents got older and said the same thing. I will probably end up telling my kids the same thing. My kids are blessing and I would not trade them for anything. My wife and I will probably agree that some of the best times in our lives were the births of our four children. I know a lot of people that say they are OK with no children, but I see their faces at gatherings when my kids come and hug me for no reason or ask me for help. To each his own, but I am a better man than who I'd be because of my kids.
Hey Maury, good to hear from you - sorry for the delay, ice storm in Texas had me staying home with my kiddo, not much time for Substack!
I think just about everyone has the same thought at some point or another, especially when we compare things to when we were growing up. I know I romanticize the 90s and the stability I felt growing up vs. the volatility I see today - even though things are generally better. I tend to think of kids as the driver of things getting better - namely through their parents wanting to make things better for them in the future, which gets to what you were saying about responsibility.
My Paw Paw once told me that I need to leave the world better than I found it. Knowing my kids are watching my every move and learning from my example, helps me do that. It's legacy-building I do not take lightly. No worries, Dylan. We had some ice here in Tennessee as well.
I have 4 siblings. Our father left our mother immediately after the youngest turned 18 and has since divorced her. She's been living alone for the past 3 years - for the first time in her life - and says she has never been happier.
First, sorry for the slow reply, the ice storm here in Texas knocked a lot of normal life offline for a few days, including Substack time.
Thank you for sharing this & being so open about it. If you don’t mind me asking, do you think your mom’s happiness is more about finally being out of a marriage that had run its course, or about no longer having kids at home? Or maybe both? I ask because those feel like very different things, and I’m trying to be careful not to conflate relief from a broken relationship with regret over having children in the first place.
She says that she was always told that she would be lonely and sad if she remained single and childless and that she has now discovered that isn't true - she has never been happier. If she were a young woman today she would not marry or have children.
I’m genuinely willing and able to make the sacrifices needed to have children, that’s not my issue. The biggest issue that I have a hard time getting over is bringing new life onto a planet that might be uninhabitable by the time I’m in my sunset years, let alone my children. I picture them enduring unimaginable weather and competing with others for basics such as clean water….and all the sudden, parenthood seems a bit like selfish folly, subjecting the beings you care about the most to a dreadful struggle. I’m genuinely open to a different way to look at this issue, but I can’t currently figure out to resolve it in my mind.
Sorry for the delayed response; the ice storm here in Texas knocked a lot of normal life offline for a few days.
I appreciate how seriously you’re thinking about this. I don’t think that concern is frivolous or selfish - it’s rooted in wanting to spare your kids from suffering.
That said, I’m wary of letting worst-case projections become the deciding factor for whether life itself is worth passing on. History is full of moments when people reasonably believed they were bringing children into a deteriorating world, and yet those children went on to make it more livable, not less. For me, having kids isn’t a denial of real challenges; it’s a refusal to let despair have the final word about the future.
A good conversation. I’ll add a phrase I saw someone use recently, “Having a child is and has always been an act of hope. And holding a newborn is hope incarnate.”
i have felt such peace since i made the decision to not have kids. and i have felt no need to explain why. i’m not hurting anyone, so there’s no need to justify myself. no, my life is not perfect. but it’s all mine.
Don't fall for this. Imagine yourself as a peasant in the medieval Europe because that's what most of us are, hidden behind the facade of addictive social media. Think who is benefitting from your natural urge to pair up and have kids.
This is really beautifully said. "A society that treats responsibility as something best avoided eventually struggles to find people willing to carry it at all." That broke my heart a little bit.
It seems to be a case of the glass half empty or half full. As society promotes individual freedom over responsibility, the view trends towards the half empty view.
I think the problem is treating having children as a goal rather than a fact of life, at least here in the US. The parenting culture is especially insane, and of the people I know that have children, all they talk about is their kids. No hobbies, no aspirations, just their kids.
So, there are absolutely some people who make their kids their whole personality and live vicariously through them.
That said, speaking from my own experience & conversations with other parents, for most of us, hobbies and goals are still there, they're just rewired around the responsibility of having a kid. I aspire to do well at work, but it's less about personal ambition and more about providing a stable environment for my son to grow up in. I love to read and write, and I still carve out time to keep up with friends over video games, but my son does take priority over those things if the need arises. We talk about our kids a lot because we love them a lot - but if you find the right topic, I think many parents would welcome the chance to talk about other stuff.
But what’s going to happen to you once your son leaves the nest?
If I get my way, I'll still be reading and writing, playing video games with friends - I'll just have more time for those things, especially after retirement. That, and more travelling. All with the added bonus of knowing that I've prepared my son for the world and the hope that he knows that if he ever needs me as he makes his way through that world, I'll be there.
Granted, that's at least 16 years away and my wife & I are hoping for at least one more kiddo, so we've got a ways to go before then.
But why can’t you do those things now?
Sorry if I wasn't clear on that - I already do those things now. I read and write during downtime, I have a dedicated game night with friends each week, and my family travels 1-2 times a year. I may have more time for those things when the nest is empty, but I already have plenty of things that give me fulfillment in addition to being a dad.
Hmm, I guess that’s fair. Thanks!
I think the meaning point is key. I’m still in a life stage where most of my friends don’t have kids yet, so I know a lot of people living the DINK lifestyle. It is really nice in many ways—lots of travel, good food, lots of time for socializing with friends—but also many of these friends express various existential anxieties. They’ll say things like “I don’t know what I’m doing with my life”, or decide to move to new cities to shake things up but then not seem to feel much different once they settle in. I’ve felt a lot of this myself as a single person who doesn’t (yet) have kids.
Parents may have more obligations and stressors, but they also have an answer to their existential anxieties.
Great point, Marcus. I think that search for meaning is a natural part of being human. While I don't think it's impossible for people to find meaning and satisfaction without kids, I think a lot of things have to go right for that happen - many of which may not be in our control. While I'll be the first to say that there are absolutely obligations with parenting, those obligations are what help make it meaningful.
Boomers infantilized and helicopter parented their kids and I think it has much to do with this.
They complained so much to their kids about how hard it was to raise them, and how much they “had to” sacrifice and worry.
Boomers still treat fully grown middle age adults like children, micromanage them, etc. and seem to have no awareness that yes, your son/daughter doesn’t know how to cook because, whereas you were 5 years old cooking for your siblings, they were 12 and you wouldn’t let them use the microwave, or you may have attempted to teach them to cook but they got something slightly wrong and the boomer said “looks like you’re not ready to cook. I’ll do it so it’s done right. I’m the only one who ever does anything around here!”
Big surprise a lot of people don’t want to replicate that.
This is so beautifully written!
Thank you so much, Darby!
I strongly agree with what you’re arguing here.
On an individual level, choosing not to have children can be economically rational. That’s hard to deny. But when that logic scales across society, it tends to drift toward a worldview where anything beyond one’s own lifetime feels optional or abstract. Rational choices at the individual level don’t always add up to rational outcomes for society as a whole.
If we care about social continuity — not in a moralizing way, but in a practical one — then some people choosing to raise children becomes necessary. Not because it’s efficient, but because it sustains the conditions that make everyday life workable in the long run.
Having children is, in many ways, deeply “irrational.” And yet, when I imagine the end of my life, the idea of having connected myself to the future through my children — and being surrounded by them at the end — feels profoundly meaningful. That outcome carries real value, even if it can’t be captured by short-term cost-benefit analysis.
So the question may not be whether raising children is rational in a narrow sense, but whether paying the time and economic costs for the sake of the final image of one’s life is truly irrational at all. That seems worth sitting with.
Hi Shun, sorry for the slight delay in responding, we had inclement weather and I was home with my son!
I think we are on the exact same page - the microeconomic rationale for having kids has inverted, while the macroeconomic rationale is becoming increasingly fraught, and that cuts across borders.
If you're interested, I've got an older piece that went into the bigger picture of the practical impacts of people choosing not to have kids: https://fatherhoodframework.substack.com/p/can-we-afford-to-not-have-another?r=1hkaq9
Also, total sidebar, but my family and I visited Japan last year, and loved it, particularly Tokyo. Looking forward to reading more of your work!
This is so beautifully written.
Thanks so much, Bri, I so appreciate it! Also, sorry for the slight delay in responding, ice storm down in Texas had me staying home with my kiddo a couple of days - not much time for Substack!
I can only speak for myself. If I didn't have kids, I feel I would be more selfish and less responsible. My grandparents told me growing up that the world was going to hell in a hand basket. Then my parents got older and said the same thing. I will probably end up telling my kids the same thing. My kids are blessing and I would not trade them for anything. My wife and I will probably agree that some of the best times in our lives were the births of our four children. I know a lot of people that say they are OK with no children, but I see their faces at gatherings when my kids come and hug me for no reason or ask me for help. To each his own, but I am a better man than who I'd be because of my kids.
Hey Maury, good to hear from you - sorry for the delay, ice storm in Texas had me staying home with my kiddo, not much time for Substack!
I think just about everyone has the same thought at some point or another, especially when we compare things to when we were growing up. I know I romanticize the 90s and the stability I felt growing up vs. the volatility I see today - even though things are generally better. I tend to think of kids as the driver of things getting better - namely through their parents wanting to make things better for them in the future, which gets to what you were saying about responsibility.
My Paw Paw once told me that I need to leave the world better than I found it. Knowing my kids are watching my every move and learning from my example, helps me do that. It's legacy-building I do not take lightly. No worries, Dylan. We had some ice here in Tennessee as well.
1) Love that. 2) I call my grandpa Paw Paw too. It is the king of grandpa names.
Agreed, that and Grandaddy
I have 4 siblings. Our father left our mother immediately after the youngest turned 18 and has since divorced her. She's been living alone for the past 3 years - for the first time in her life - and says she has never been happier.
First, sorry for the slow reply, the ice storm here in Texas knocked a lot of normal life offline for a few days, including Substack time.
Thank you for sharing this & being so open about it. If you don’t mind me asking, do you think your mom’s happiness is more about finally being out of a marriage that had run its course, or about no longer having kids at home? Or maybe both? I ask because those feel like very different things, and I’m trying to be careful not to conflate relief from a broken relationship with regret over having children in the first place.
She says that she was always told that she would be lonely and sad if she remained single and childless and that she has now discovered that isn't true - she has never been happier. If she were a young woman today she would not marry or have children.
I’m genuinely willing and able to make the sacrifices needed to have children, that’s not my issue. The biggest issue that I have a hard time getting over is bringing new life onto a planet that might be uninhabitable by the time I’m in my sunset years, let alone my children. I picture them enduring unimaginable weather and competing with others for basics such as clean water….and all the sudden, parenthood seems a bit like selfish folly, subjecting the beings you care about the most to a dreadful struggle. I’m genuinely open to a different way to look at this issue, but I can’t currently figure out to resolve it in my mind.
Sorry for the delayed response; the ice storm here in Texas knocked a lot of normal life offline for a few days.
I appreciate how seriously you’re thinking about this. I don’t think that concern is frivolous or selfish - it’s rooted in wanting to spare your kids from suffering.
That said, I’m wary of letting worst-case projections become the deciding factor for whether life itself is worth passing on. History is full of moments when people reasonably believed they were bringing children into a deteriorating world, and yet those children went on to make it more livable, not less. For me, having kids isn’t a denial of real challenges; it’s a refusal to let despair have the final word about the future.
Thank you, that is a helpful perspective
A good conversation. I’ll add a phrase I saw someone use recently, “Having a child is and has always been an act of hope. And holding a newborn is hope incarnate.”
i have felt such peace since i made the decision to not have kids. and i have felt no need to explain why. i’m not hurting anyone, so there’s no need to justify myself. no, my life is not perfect. but it’s all mine.
Don't fall for this. Imagine yourself as a peasant in the medieval Europe because that's what most of us are, hidden behind the facade of addictive social media. Think who is benefitting from your natural urge to pair up and have kids.
Your kids obviously, are the primary beneficiaries.
This is really beautifully said. "A society that treats responsibility as something best avoided eventually struggles to find people willing to carry it at all." That broke my heart a little bit.
It seems to be a case of the glass half empty or half full. As society promotes individual freedom over responsibility, the view trends towards the half empty view.
Beautifully written!